Publishing

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Permalink Reply by Mike Blackburn on March 12, 2008 at 1:21pm

Hi Keiran

A good place to start would be a reputable Christian publishing house. Here is one you could start with...

Music Submissions Department
Kevin Mayhew Publishers,
Buxhall,
Stowmarket,
Suffolk
IP14 3BW

They are not alone, but they do actively seek submissions, and they will give you feedback (it might take a while).

If you're thinking about publishing a whole book yourself, then it might be different - do you have that much material?

All the best,

Mike

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Permalink Reply by Kieran Metcalfe on March 12, 2008 at 1:28pm

I've got a few songs - probably 7 or 8. Maybe not enough to do my own book though. I guess the other side is then you have to get the book marketed etc, and then that's a whole other ball park.

I'm a total novice in that area though, so I have no real idea how it works, but I was assuming that if you sumbit stuff it could end up in a compilation book (along the lines of Songs of Fellowship).

Thanks for the address - I'll definitely give that a try!

Many thanks

Kiers

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Permalink Reply by Matt Osgood on March 12, 2008 at 3:47pm

Hi Kieran,

Other places to try are the Spring Harvest book - they (I think) listen to submissions from anyone. And I know the deadline has passed for the latest Soul Survivor People's Album, but if another one is made that's something worth submitting your songs to.

To be honest though, most conventional ways of publishing through books and to a lesser extent albums are all being replaced by web-based stuff. I had a quick look at your site (very nice!) and that's probably as close to being 'published' as you need to be. If you register your songs with CCL then any church can download them, and when they do a report it should be possible for you to claim royalties. Sites like this are partially for the purpose of people being able to share their songs - if others on this site like your songs I'm sure they will download them from your site and use them. (So start plugging! :)

Also have a look at www.christiansongwriters.org - there's a slot on the forum there to post worship songs. And www.worshiptogether.com and www.songdiscovery.com are other places where you can plug your songs (not that they're as good as this site of course...)

I had a song put in last years Spring Harvest song-book, and I'd be very surprised if anyone who bought the book actually used it - when was the last time you went through a songbook, picked out a song you'd never heard before, and used it in church? If you're anything like me you'll always go to songbooks to try and find the music for songs you already know because you've heard them at a conference or on an album. The advantage of being web-based is that people can hear your songs as well as get the music.

I'm involved in a project called www.resoundworship.org which is a free worship song resource providing mp3s and music to download (see, that was a plug - it's very easy really ;) we're supported by Jubilate Publishing, but they have no plans to produce a songbook or CD album from the site's material - what would be the point when everything is already available for free on-line? Books are generally difficult to sell and there's a diminishing market for them - Soul Survivor for one are recognising this, their last songbook was the 'digital songbook' compilation, where you just got a CD-ROM containing all the songs from books 1-4 and you printed out the ones you wanted. Transfer the contents of the CD onto the web and that's the way everything's going at the moment. Have a look at www.songselect.com as well - that's the official CCL service where you pay an annual subscription and then you can download and print a certain number of songs per year - it's a bit hit or miss whether they actually have the song you want, but because it's on-line you can do cool things like change the key of a chord chart or lead sheet before you print it. Nice.

Anyway, hope some of that rambling is useful...

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Permalink Reply by Kieran Metcalfe on March 12, 2008 at 3:58pm

Hi

Thanks for that Matt - very helpful stuff.

I did have a nagging thought that maybe the web was the way to go - Power To The People and all that!

I've tried a couple of other forums (christiansongwriters being one of them) and had good feedback so far. I'll keep plugging away and see where things go.

I think I sent you an out-of-the-blue mail yesterday after finding the resoundWorship project via google (asking about how to sign up with CCL). I've since contacted them directly, but their initial response wasn't too clear, so I'll go back to them. In short though, does it cost anything to register songs with them? Am I best doing that as an individual, or via a larger organisation?

Many thanks for the info and taking time to give such a detailed response - it's very much appreciated.

Kieran

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Permalink Reply by Matt Osgood on March 12, 2008 at 9:55pm

Hi Kieran,

I've had to phone the CCLi UK people a couple of times to sort out things relating to our church license and they've been consistently helpful. I'm not sure exactly what the required process is as all the RESOUND stuff is registered through Jubilate (www.jubilate.co.uk - up to now they've mostly done modern hymns, but are supporting RESOUND as a hopefully theologically sound new song-writing initiative) so we don't have to worry about the copyright.

However, I'm pretty certain that you can sort things our re CCL as an individual - easiest thing to do is give them a ring on 01323 417711, explain what you want to do and they will let you know what the process is. I'm pretty sure you're not the first individual to want to do this! I have a vague memory of someone saying that you end up registering your songs with Copycare if you're an individual, and they collect royalties for you in return for a percentage. You can collect royalties yourself as an individual but I think the amount of admin required for that is prohibitive. Have a look at http://www.copycare.com/content/local/ccukeng.asp as well, but I think the most helpful thing to do is give the CCL UK people a ring.

Let me know if you get it sorted, I'd be interested to know what the answer is!

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Permalink Reply by Kieran Metcalfe on March 13, 2008 at 12:59pm

Hi Matt

You're right - they're much clearer on the phone. I guess my main confusion was finding out who does what in the whole process. I spoke to CopyCare too, and they added a bit more detail to it all.

CCLI's response was basically that I'm fine to register as an individual - all I'm doing is providing a way for churches to declare that they're using the songs, and maybe accrue some royalties on that. They're sending the forms for me to look at, so I might do that, but it's essentially just like opening an account with them.

CopyCare gave me a lot of good information which put CCLI in perspective as a link in the chain, and also a couple of tips about what sort of milestones would indicate that it's time to look at working with CopyCare.

Overall, the consensus seems to be that I'd be jumping the gun if I start going too far down any of those routes right now - I need to be looking more at the plugging and exposure side of things (just like what you said in the first place!). It's all a bit chicken and egg. You need the exposure to get in with the publishers, but, obviously, a publishers marketing clout gives you a lot of exposure....

Thanks for all the advice. I don't think I've found anything out that you didn't already know, but it's all there in case anyone else finds it helpful.

Kieran

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Permalink Reply by Gav on March 13, 2008 at 3:42pm

hi keiran,

firstly hello pleased to meet you secondly, i feel quite strongly about this subject so apologees if i rant.
you say, "I'm purely thinking in terms of getting songs 'out there' for people to use if they like them".

heres a couple of questions i have whenever i hear comments like this:

1. why do you want to get your songs out there?
2. what if youre songs never get out of your local church?

there are too many people trying to get songs out there missing the point.
why dont we ask questions like, how can i write songs that help my church worship God?
or how can i play songs in places outjside of the church where non christians can hear about Jesus?

now please dont misunderstand me, theres nothing wrong with published songs but for most of us
its meaningless. hardly anyone will use the songs even if there are in a songs of fellowship book
as no one has heard of us. ive wrestled with this one myself many times believe me. but ive tried to
be content that my songs may only be used in my local church but THATS NOT A BAD THING!!

im just sad that there are so many worship leaders/songwriters that are living in dissapointment cos
theyre not tim hughes or matt redman. but guess what God never meant us to be them he meant us to be us!

ok rant over! i would personally love to hear some of your songs and would give you honest and constructive feedback.
im no expert but i have ideas you may find helpful. do you mind if i do that? i promise i will try and be encouraging!!


God bless,
gavin.

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Permalink Reply by Phil Williams on March 13, 2008 at 3:49pm

You can post the songs on here too - not just on mySpace ;-)

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Permalink Reply by Kieran Metcalfe on March 13, 2008 at 3:56pm

oh, yeah - my bad - I should have said - My songs are on my profile here too!

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Permalink Reply by Kieran Metcalfe on March 13, 2008 at 3:55pm

Hi Gavin

I agree TOTALLY with you. To be honest, the process of looking into publishing has made me really question what it is that's making me look into it. At the end of the day, like you say, I'm involved in a local church, and so primarily, my songs are for use there. (Maybe I'm just having to go through this process to allow myself to accept that that is the boundary of my calling).

On the flip side, as an artist, there's always a drive to get songs heard by a wide audience, maybe because of the time that goes into them.

The initial catalyst was a number of people who have either asked if I've thought about publishing, or in one case, just asked who WAS publishing a song..... I guess some of that possibly comes from, like me, not really knowing a lot about how the 'industry' works.

I remember a day shortly after this first came up. I made a decision that whether it came to anything or not, I was going to push the door and see what happens. If it comes to nothing, then I've not lost anything. But I'd rather that, than wondering, down the line, if I should have tried...... do you follow?

I've got some of my songs online at http://www.kieranmetcalfe.org.uk - feel free to fire off any comments you like - I'd love to hear them. Do you have any of your songs online?

Thanks

Kiers

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Permalink Reply by Gav on March 13, 2008 at 4:21pm

hi keiran,

God bless you for your reply, i hear you on the pushing the door thing.
its just a big concern i have for worship leaders and songwriters in this generation. never before has the church had such a multi million pound industry and its easy to lose track of why we do what we do in the first place.

i'll certainly check out your songs on this site and your website, and matt has given you some great advice also.

yes ive got some songs on myspace.com/gavinjcball and on here that ive just literally loaded up!

God bless,
gavin.

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Permalink Reply by Dave Fordham on March 21, 2008 at 6:59pm

Hi Kieran. As for "getting your songs out there" why not try http://www.familyworship.org.uk/showcase It's a free site for Christian songwriters to get their music online, lots of hits aswell - with the ability to provide the listeners with full downloads of mp3's, chord sheets and have links to their personal sites/sites they are affiliated with.

Otherwise, just purge as many music sites as you can, build up a reputation - be great to see where it leads, keep me posted - i'd like to hear more of ya music!

Dave

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